Alex on CM: "The Big Wheel" - SPOILER thread

[redwinter101]

And how sad that what he drinks is milk... sorta a kid's beverage. Heart-breaking...

Hadn't thought about the relevance of milk being a kid's beverage though.

Lovely call, Grace.

*sniffle*

There was definitely something child-like (in an eerie way) about Vincent: the underdeveloped emotions, the sense of a desire to be a kid again before the time when his mother was murdered, the awkwardness.

Very sad.

Red

[SirenSong]

In the scene where he's watching the edited version of the kill, he also looks like he's enjoying it, maybe getting excited by it. And that face as he stabs the real estate agent, that definitely looked a bit like an "o" face, imo. So I think sexual psychopath wasn't too far off the mark.

[nayp]

Kelly, by off profile, I mean the BAU Team were wrong in their profile. What you've said is exactly what I was trying to say, but you said it so much better Early on in the episode, they tagged him for a sexual psychopath. That was wrong. Vincent was not filming these women to relive the moment for sexual gratification. We then learn that Vincent's mother had been stabbed to death by his father. Vicent stayed with his mother for hours, most likely witnessing the life pass out of her, out of her eyes. Thus his fascination with watching the eyes of the women he killed. Obviously no one recognized the mental health issues that a young Vincent was dealing with and this illness, combined with his OCD, ultimately let to the man we see as an adult Vincent. I would have loved for the BAU Team to realize their mistake and admit as such before the episode was over. Again, I can't wait to talk to my work colleagues tomorrow and see what they think. As I said above, they actual hate Criminal Minds with a passion, saying they oversimplify a very complex and always evolving science.

Alex did a great job of showing how scared, alone and confused Vincent felt in the real world. He struck out at the perceived source of his misery, i.e. these women and/or society in general. His OCD only added to the psychosis he'd been dealing with as a result of witnessing his mother's murder.

I agree, it would have been nice to hear the team acknowledge that the killings weren't for sexual gratification.

Speaking of young Vincent witnessing his mother's murder, it was just a flash but did the kid seem 'off'? Odd reaction I thought.

I thought the same thing about young Vincent's reaction. Makes you wonder how much his mother's actions had scarred him before her murder happened. How much more had he been witness to over the years while hiding in that closet?

When Vincent made the comment in the ferris wheel, he said my father and I did bad things? If that was case, he had major problems has a child to. The newspaper article had husband killed wife, but the team never mentioned that.

[Overdamoon]

I am so glad that you all brought up that entire "sexual psychopath" issue. I thought it was just me missing something, when they never referenced it again. I realize in the beginning of the episode, there is a lot of brainstorming going on, throwing out different ideas and hypotheses, I just wish they would have cleared that up a bit better later on.

And another thing that drove me a bit crazy, for a guy who was so particular about everything--due to his debilitating OCD, I was floored when he drank the milk straight from the container!! I realize he lived alone, and no one was sharing it with him, but he also used a new bar of soap every time he washed his hands, and cut his sandwich a certain way, etc.

That just seemed to be such a normal guy thing to do--and very un-Vincent.

I saw that, and my take on that, was he knew he was going to die.

Yeah I think that was the point... He DID act out of character, for a reason. He had been shot, was in enormous pain... you saw the look on his face while and after drinking... he was in life- preservation mode... probably dehydrating with a shower and blood loss... so he desperately gulped milk... dressed his wounds... and then willed himself to take Stanley on their date. And how sad that what he drinks is milk... sorta a kid's beverage. Heart-breaking...

Ditto Sister! He was devolving as they'd said, and almost literally coming apart at the seams. I'll also file with that, him putting his hands all over that ferris wheel safety bar without sanitizing! J/K! That would have detracted from the scene, wouldn't it? Hadn't thought about the relevance of milk being a kid's beverage though.

It's a weird feeling to watch this episode with one and 2 half men (hubby and 2 teenage sons) and come here to read the women's perspectives. They were disappointed with the ending, thought it anticlimactic that Vincent just died peacefully on the chair. They wanted some big pow-wow like Vincent taking his life and plunging from above. Or Vincent climbing out and doing the high bar like Mick in AD.

It feels so much better reading and agreeing with your viewpoints here.

[wpgrace]

Kelly, by off profile, I mean the BAU Team were wrong in their profile. What you've said is exactly what I was trying to say, but you said it so much better Early on in the episode, they tagged him for a sexual psychopath. That was wrong. Vincent was not filming these women to relive the moment for sexual gratification. We then learn that Vincent's mother had been stabbed to death by his father. Vicent stayed with his mother for hours, most likely witnessing the life pass out of her, out of her eyes. Thus his fascination with watching the eyes of the women he killed. Obviously no one recognized the mental health issues that a young Vincent was dealing with and this illness, combined with his OCD, ultimately let to the man we see as an adult Vincent. I would have loved for the BAU Team to realize their mistake and admit as such before the episode was over. Again, I can't wait to talk to my work colleagues tomorrow and see what they think. As I said above, they actual hate Criminal Minds with a passion, saying they oversimplify a very complex and always evolving science.

Alex did a great job of showing how scared, alone and confused Vincent felt in the real world. He struck out at the perceived source of his misery, i.e. these women and/or society in general. His OCD only added to the psychosis he'd been dealing with as a result of witnessing his mother's murder.

I agree, it would have been nice to hear the team acknowledge that the killings weren't for sexual gratification.

Speaking of young Vincent witnessing his mother's murder, it was just a flash but did the kid seem 'off'? Odd reaction I thought.

I thought the same thing about young Vincent's reaction. Makes you wonder how much his mother's actions had scarred him before her murder happened. How much more had he been witness to over the years while hiding in that closet?

When Vincent made the comment in the ferris wheel, he said my father and I did bad things? If that was case, he had major problems has a child to. The newspaper article had husband killed wife, but the team never mentioned that.

Yes I don't think Vincent ever had much happiness in life... And I'm not sure he "got" that he was a sexual psycho killer... He seemed to have a very immature reaction to Alice's come-on... he didn't know what to do with real sexuality... So poor guy... He never had a chance...

[Phoenix]

Isn't that kinda early for you Phee?

And I think I'll go ditto one of Grace's comments now.

It's been a really long day, mwj...

And how sad that what he drinks is milk... sorta a kid's beverage. Heart-breaking...

Hadn't thought about the relevance of milk being a kid's beverage though.

Lovely call, Grace.

*sniffle*

There was definitely something child-like (in an eerie way) about Vincent: the underdeveloped emotions, the sense of a desire to be a kid again before the time when his mother was murdered, the awkwardness.

Very sad.

Red

And ditto what Red wrote, too.

[mwj01]

Phee!

Yes I don't think Vincent ever had much happiness in life... And I'm not sure he "got" that he was a sexual psycho killer... He seemed to have a very immature reaction to Alice's come-on... he didn't know what to do with real sexuality... So poor guy... He never had a chance...

No he didn't seem to "get" anything sexual. I saw the smile when he was watching the tape, as well as the "O" face when he killed the realtor, more as possibly happiness at connecting with his mother, rewinding to at least a few moments before she died - and also satisfying his compulsion. Doesn't surrendering to the compulsion make sufferers of OCD feel better?

[Fleur de Lisa]

I am torn between thinking it was satisfaction of the compulsion and/or sexual gratification.
This guy was so emotionally stunted, that it probably affected him sexually, as well.

It still amazes me how getting shot threw out the OCD tendencies.

[cassysj]

It still amazes me how getting shot threw out the OCD tendencies.

Well, as someone who has dealt with mild OCD it's not always a matter of throwing out the tendencies as being able to conceal them from others or in the case of getting shot your brain is concentrating on survival mode and that can possibly override the other part of your brain.

[francis]

There was some kind of pleasure or release in that scene. here is the visual to odm's comment

My take on the sexual thing: Giving in to his urges of killing must feel kind of orgasmic to him, as he's struggling with it and is driven to do everything a certain way on that particular day. He just can't stop, and finally, when the deed is done, the urge relents and he might feel like breathing after being suffocated. Just my take on this, I'm no profiler or something.

And I see certain things in his behaviour as being very insecure in his sexuality. He saw his mother sleeping with other men, and he saw his father kill her for that. So sex must be something for him that will be punished severely. He lies in bed with so much tension, his hands on the blanket like they are handcuffed by his compulsion, his clothes plain and totally encasing him. There's nothing remotely free or sensual in his way he sees his body. He can't even stand to see himself in a mirror much, except for that short scene where he jokes with himself (eerie, as it's a bit out of character and that makes it all the more striking - he's not one-dimensional, not even in his OCD).
He even takes another pair of slippers to the bathroom, so I guess everything having to do with bodily functions must be dirty to him. Even his meals are sanitized, wrapped in saran, white, tasteless. He doesn't use any ketchup or sauce, it would stain. He eats standing up, as if he was ashamed he even had to eat.
So, I can't even imagine him ever having a sexual reaction without feeling tremendous shame and guilt. When Alice comes on to him, she is a threat to his precarious sanity, he has to get her out of his meticulously clean home, and when she doesn't go, he gets more and more agitated. I think he killed her not only because she recognized him, and endangered his plans for the day, but also because she was so full-blooded female. He felt threatened by her.

Excuse my ramblings.

[Fleur de Lisa]

Wow, francis.

That was intense and so accurate. No rambling at all. Great insight into Vincent--well done!

[Jade]

^ yeah thanks really interesting and well written.

[willing freshie]

Just sitting here reading everybody's comments. All of them are excellent. It would be great if someone could ask Alex some of these questions: Did Vincent achieve sexual gratification or just finishes the yearly OCD cycle of reenacting his mother's death?

I believe he was a virgin but I believe he did achieve sexual gratification not as the goal of his act,but as an effect. In other words, he didn't set out to kill for sexual pleasure but it just happened. Since he couldn't have normal relations with women, and since he probably felt any form of self-gratification was dirty; that would be his release;though not intentional.

Do I make any sense here?

[mwj01]

Nice review, although they're calling him O'Laughlin.

ENTERTAINMENT - TOP STORY
O'Laughlin's triumphant return to TV

http://www.tbtv.com/Entertainment-Story.aspx?cid=117744

[allegrita]

Francis, thank you very much for that interesting insight. I thought much the same thing... Vincent couldn't allow himself to be physical or sexual at all, and if he felt any sexual feelings, he had to disguise them from himself. The guy ate half a (trimmed) sandwich for breakfast, for criminy's sake. Talk about denying one's physical needs!

Think about the videotape of his mom's murder. I figure that Vincent was videotaping his mother from the closet because he was deriving some sort of sexual pleasure from watching his mom with the other man. And then when his mom was murdered by his dad--for doing something that Vincent was getting off on, and knew was wrong-- no wonder he was messed up, poor guy. He must have just tortured himself from that moment on--blaming himself for his mother's death, and yet also identifying with his father's rage at her. And by murdering all the blonde women, he was trying again and again to reconnect with his mother, which was impossible--because that connection was so confused--a combination of rage, abandonment, forbidden and "dirty" lust, and guilt.

I think that Alex did a wonderful job of portraying a guy who is completely closed off from himself--not only by OCD, but by guilt and repression. The way he snatched his hand away from Stan at the park was so telling to me... as was the way he held hands, bare hands, with him at the very end. Stan was his redemption, and Vincent loved him for that, at the same time he suffered tremendously from even more guilt for having murdered Stan's mom.

Vincent told Stan to never wish for death--and I believe he could never have overtly committed suicide, because of his repression--but I wonder if perhaps that's why he went to the part of town where he got attacked. Maybe he was committing suicide in the only way he could. And if he'd lived through that, I can see him putting himself into a situation where the cops had to kill him.